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Hi Everyone,
My name is Beth. I was given a copy of HTBNTBEM (ha) back in 1997. Sigh. Why didn’t I just believe it then? The thing was, I knew it was true. The problem was that I read some other stuff that convinced me that I was the great exception to all rules - my body, for whatever reason, really didn’t know how to eat. It was naturally addicted to carbs, or sugar, or whatever. At the time I was given the book, I had been losing weight at that point by eating once a day, sometimes twice. I was really underfed. Still overweight, but really underfed. I started eating, gained weight, waffled around, tried some more fasting, then tried (Oh no) a low carb diet. For months. What low carb meant for me was an 80 pound weight loss, a 100 pound weight gain, and lots and lots of just plain not eating. I think I must be quite famine sensitive. The boomerang was like nothing I’ve ever experienced before - I literally could NOT stop eating empty carbs. could not. And weight gain was like….the easiest thing in the world. Even going back on the draconian diet could not make me lose anything at that point. and I couldn’t stick it either.
Anyway. Two years ago, I found something else - lots of emphasis on eating plenty of protein, lots of emphasis on eating enough whole grain carbs and veggies, weening yourself off any white carbs and sugar. It took me about a year and a half to get totally weened off, and it was great because for the first time since my first diet at age 10, I felt in control of my eating. I gained yet more weight doing it, which brought comments from family members and lots of skepticism, but I stuck with it. My low-carb diet had convinced me that dieting would never work, and I vowed never to do it again.
Thing is, I lost 40 pounds without really trying after a while. Then the weight loss stopped. And I started to notice that I was hungry between meals more often. I started to have cravings for the old foods (even sugar, which really had no appeal before). The program I was following before emphasized only eating every 5 to 6 hours. And the amount of protein I was supposed to have at each meal made me feel overfull sometimes. So, last week, I was following my plan, and found myself really hungry after 3 hours. but I was forcing myself to wait. Then I had a potato chip binge. I hadn’t binged in a long time. This was disturbing. It made me start thinking, “Maybe I’m not eating enough, or often enough” and I remembered the naturally thin way. So, I’ve ordered the book from Amazon, stocked my fridge with real food (which I was eating pretty much exclusively before anyway - no pleasure foods except that potato chip run in).
I am scared to try this. But I am sick of having other people tell me what to eat. And I am sick of thinking that there’s just something wrong with me, or my body, or whatever, that makes it impossible for me to listen to what my body is saying. The last two mornings, I’ve gotten up and apologized to my body, “I’m so sorry that I have starved you and overfed you and I am going to try to listen from now on.”
I don’t know when I’m hungry (although that’s easier for me), and I don’t know when I’m full. I’ve been used to thinking that I had to clear my plate because I had to get that amount of protein into me at each meal. So…this is hard, and this is scary.
Sorry this is so long. That’s my sad, sad, story. I don’t know if I’ll ever be naturally THIN, but I want to be healthy and take care of my body and listen to it. I guess that’s my goal for now.
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Beth! Honey! For starters, welcome. We’re glad you’re here. If your posts start to rival War and Peace, they’re too long. Anything short of that we can handle!
I’m so sorry you’ve been so all over the place with your eating. It’s so frustrating, and we’ve been sooooooo lied to. We’ve all been where you’ve been - to varying degrees - and I can say with certainty that you’re on the right path. From the stories I’ve read in Jean’s books, and my own experience, I’m pretty sure your body is functioning perfectly, just the way it’s designed. And its design is to keep you from starving yourself to death.
Get the book, read the book and read it again and again and again! I also found it helpful to read all the old posts on this forum. When I first started here, I “met” Swan who had been through the process and was finally thin. As I started reading older posts, I got to read Swan as she was starting out and going through the changes, and what a difference in the way she talked about things! Reading details from someone’s walk from when they started to when they felt like a success story has been incredibly encouraging.
So dive in, sister, and know that we’re here to encourage and inform you in any way we can, and we look forward to hearing the steps you take!!
Best,
annual
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Hi Annual,
Thanks for the welcome. I’m on day two of trying to listen to my body, and hoping my book arrives from Amazon quickly. I can sort of remember the basics, and I’ve been reading everything on the website that I can find. I like your idea of reading all the old posts. I’ve read a few. Someone on the Oprah thread mentioned the Hcg diet. Oh my gosh. Four of my coworkers have done it. I toyed with the idea then bonked myself on the head and reminded myself DIETS DON’T WORK!! Sadly, one of my coworkers who did it was a recovering anorexic. She was normal weight before she did it - looked great. I have no idea why she did it… she said it was because her eating habits were bad and she wanted to improve them. I’m really concerned about her. She got incredibly moody while doing it, weeping all over the place, etc. Part of why I started trying to eat well in the first place was because of the effects of starvation on my moods. I ended up on prozac at the end of the low-carb diet. It took me a couple more years to ween myself off that again. And the side effects…very nasty.
Anyway. Enough rambling. Tell me how you know you’re full Annual, because that’s kind of a mystery to me. Right now I’m going with the rule of thumb of my belly feels happy and I’m going to be able to get on with my day without thinking about it because it’s not hungry or feeling overstuffed. It’s hard to know when I’ve got there though. I feel like I’m hungry too often. Like…six times a day! Is this normal?
Thanks!
Beth Ann
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Yup. Normal. Happy belly is a good sign. You’re supposed to eat as soon as you get hungry. Eat real food (there’s a list in the book of what’s quality food, what’s “borderline” and what’s considered pleasure food). When I first started, I would eat until I was no longer hungry, but I discovered “no longer hungry” is not the same as SATISFIED. It can take a while to figure this out. You’ll undereat sometimes; overeat others. But you’ll know it when you’ve done it (“ooooh, I shouldn’t have eaten those last few bites”) and you’ll learn your body’s signals for hunger and fulness.
Because I wasn’t eating enough, I was hungry every 60-90 minutes. I tried eating more (gained more weight - eek!) and THEN after a YEAR I finally realized I wasn’t eating meals when I was hungry, which is really what you should do. So I started eating actual meals every time I got hungry, and I felt much more satisfied each time I ate, and I ate less often. Your body will go through phases, and the first one will be a feast. If you’ve been underfed, you’re going to want plenty of food. Aim for the very highest quality food you can find and enjoy it.
Most important: this is TOUGH and it’s a PROCESS and it takes lots and lots of TIME and PRACTICE to unlearn all your bad habits. At least it did me.
Blessings and happy eating!
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I couldn’t have said it better. Thanks annual. And welcome to sanity, Beth Ann. You’re in the most difficult part, but you can do it!
Jean
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And then, Beth Ann, after a while you get the concept and can explain it to someone else well enough that the teacher pats you on the back!
*smiles*
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:). Okay, so that’s helpful. I have no idea if I’ve been eating too little. I don’t think so. Like I said, I’ve been eating three full meals a day (protein, carb, and veggies) plus sometimes a snack at bedtime if I was hungry. I was probably not eating often enough. I think (in my vast experience of the last three days - ha), that I’ve eaten about the same amount, just smaller meals more often. Today, I had breakfast, lunch about 3 and a half hours later, a snack about 4 hours after that and then a smallish dinner two and a half hours later. I could probably have had a bigger snack, to be honest. I was probably actually hungry for dinner but I was still at work. It didn’t take much dinner to fill me up. We’ll see how it holds me. I feel…virtuous when I leave food on my plate. This is probably an area for deprogramming. And I really don’t know what full feels like. I just don’t know when I’m there. Right now I’m sitting here thinking…do I need more dinner? Was that enough? I feel satisfied enough but peckish somehow. I keep telling myself though that I can eat any time I get hungry.
Packing lunch is going to be interesting. Do you have any tips? Lots of planning ahead involved, yes?
One thing I remember from the book (which should be here tomorrow I think) is the idea of getting hungry and then going to the fridge and figuring out what you really want. But what if you know that you want something that’s not made yet? Do you just eat something else or wait and eat that thing you wanted? Have a snack and then make it? Eat something else and make it so you can have it the next time you get hungry? Or do you ask yourself, of what I have, what do I want?
I feel like these are really dumb questions. I assume from what you said about eating as soon as you’re hungry that eating would be the more important thing and getting what you really want secondary.
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It’s tough at first, but after a while a pattern emerges. I find if I always have a roast chicken in my fridge, eggs and cheese, and oatmeal, bread and peanut butter in the pantry, I can meet any need. Planning ahead is absolutely critical, because if you’re hungry, you don’t want to wait an hour for something to finish cooking. At least I don’t. Jean says this is a time when it’s ok to “medicate your hunger,” or eat just enough to not be hungry. Toast with peanut butter, veggies and dip - just something to tide you over until dinner’s ready.
I’m a SAHM, so packing lunch isn’t one of my struggles. Maybe someone else can make suggestions for you on that one.
Eating as soon as you’re hungry is important, but so is eating what you’re hungry for, if you can. Your body is telling you what it needs and you’re trying to learn to listen and fill the need. It’s real tough at first, but you’ll get the hang of it.
Enjoy the book!
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Hi Beth,
I feel for you! Although I am still “new” (4 months doing NT), I feel like I’ve learned some things…..I ALWAYS have access to food. I keep a bag of raw almonds in my car, just “in case”. I take two lunch bags to work, and yes, I do get looks and people commenting on them. The most common comment being: “Wow, you have lots of bags” to which I answer: Yes, I do! I cook once a week (to make a “main” dish), NEVER eat fast food, and actually make a lot of my own food, so I know exactly what is in it. Here is what I might take for food for all day at work: two containers of homemade yogurt sweetened with Stevia, one has unsweetened crushed pineapple in it, the other one natural blueberries to which I might add homemade granola (unsweetened) to. Several peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, OR turkey sandwiches, hard boiled eggs, 2-3 pieces of fruit, a portion of a main dish (meatloaf, frittata, spaghetti, fried turkey hot dogs, etc.) carrot muffins, a nutritious juice drink, fresh spinich (to use like lettuce) and always have nuts on hand.
It does take a lot of preparation, but you get used to it. When I first started packing my food, it would take me like 20-30 minutes to get my lunch ready, but now it is not so bad. At least I know I will have plenty of food to choose from!
Another suggestion: Try and work your errands and things around your eating. If you know you are going to the store or do errands, wait until you have eaten and THEN go. That will give you at least 2 hours to do your stuff, then take nuts with you or something else to “tide you over” if needed until you get home.
If I am hungry for something that will take a while to prepare, I will eat something else so I don’t have to be hungry for any longer than necessary. I keep lots of prepared food in the fridge, so this doesn’t happen too often.
Hope this helps with some of your questions.
It does get easier, you just have to keep plugging along doing what Jean suggests in her books!
:)
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Hi New Friends,
Thanks for your good advice. All very helpful. I think I need to adjust my perspective of what is an adequate amount of food to take in my sack of a morning!
I’ve been listening to these cassette tapes (hard to find something to even play them on!) that I got from our local library (since my book just got here today) - they are “Naturally thin training classes” - given by Skip Billey - I guess one of Jean’s earlier disciples (if I want to even call her that…convert? NT person?) They have been eye opening. Suddenly I SEE it all. I get the whole feast or famine cycle. I get what I have done to my body, and why it has responded the way it has.
One thing she said which really struck me was about a man she met who was a WW2 vet - had been in a prison camp where they basically tried to starve them all to death. He was one of only ten survivors. He was about 100 pounds overweight when she met him - and she said that they couldn’t starve him to death because his body was so great at shutting down his metabolism. He has the “thrifty gene” - I think that’s what they call it now. I suddenly GOT it. I have that darn gene too, and I should be grateful - it would keep me alive in a concentration camp.
Hearing Skip’s story also really resonated with me - it took away so much shame that I’ve felt about weird relationship with food. And it also made me think about how this whole thing started. She said sometimes kids will start because they go on a mini fast when they are sick and then gain weight and then go on their first diet. My first diet was in 6th grade. That was also the year I had strep throat about three times. The last time it was so bad that I carried a cup around to spit in because I couldn’t bear to swallow. That was in December. I also have a VERY vivid (and heretofore shameful) memory one night of sneaking into our chest freezer and getting out one Christmas cookie after another and eating them froze. Maybe my first binge. I probably gained some weight (as I was anyway - going into adolescence at that point). Sometime soon after that was my first attempts at deliberate famining. I genuinely don’t remember attempting to diet or ever binging before that.
I get it. I really get it. I just read chapter 2 of the book and I finally get that my body literally cannot tell the difference between a me made famine and a real one.
I want to ask you more about lunch, Shanshan, but I think I will make a new thread to do it.
Beth Ann
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Hi, Beth,
Going back about six posts, you said you ate breakfast and then lunch at about 3. Don’t know when you get up or when breakfast is, but a 3 o’clock lunch is late if you are on a typical schedule. I recommend three meals by 1 o’clock pm, then a meal at around 3 then supper whenever. Perhaps you are having trouble knowing when you are full because you are having famines (you don’t realize) during the early hours of the day. Just a thought.
Jean
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Hi Jean,
I’m sorry if I was unclear - I said I had lunch 3 and a half hours later. I don’t know what that would have made it, but no later than 11:30 ish.
Yes. I heard on the tapes about trying to have three meals by 1. I tried that today. I had scrambled eggs with turkey and veggies and some polenta with some romano cheese for first breakfast. I had cheerios with whey protein powder and milk for second breakfast. And then a bit after 1 I had vegetable soup and 1 and a half pieces of bread with tuna and cheese melted on top. Yum. Then I wasn’t really hungry until about 4 - I had the other 1/2 piece of tuna cheese melt and a cheese stick. I was pretty hungry by the time I got home at 5:30 and had dinner right away. Brown rice, beef stroganoff, then I still was hungry, but not for any more of that, so I had cheerios and milk. I think I may really have been thirst more than still hungry…but I’m not sure.
Oh. and I had a mandarin orange for dinner too.
Anything you see that’s wonky here?
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Beth,
I sent your post to Skip Billey and she said, “You should tell her how thin I am now!” Well, I will. A formerly crazed dieter, as you know from the tapes, Skip is completely recovered and eats freely on demand. She started out at a 16-18 and now wears an 8. Her overweight relatives just can’t figure it out!
Jean
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My library doesn’t have those tapes. I’ve heard Skip mentioned before; would it be too much to ask for you to tell us her story briefly?
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Oh, that’s fantastic. I like listening to her. She seems so completely down to earth. And the tapes have really helped me. I’m reading the book too, but *hearing* it helps me too. I think I’m more of an auditory learner somehow. I was so happy to find the tapes at the library. I did have to dig up an old tape player to listen to them on.
I would need to listen to the first tape again to remember enough of the details to make a good story for you Annual. Let’s just say it was extreme. Extreme undereating led to extreme binging. And then, she met Jean and she started eating well and the binging stopped within a couple of weeks. And now, she’s NT. Amazing, and brought me a lot of hope as well.
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Beth, I could’ve been that girl who “got it” after talking to Jean in 1990. After starting NT, I never binged again. Never! It’s still something of a little miracle to be happy with food AND to be thin. I used to think those two things were mutually exclusive. I also remember Jean telling me about Skip and how she (Skip) was at that time “in denial” about how she was loosing so much weight without dieting. When I started out, I had Jean’s video but there were no audio tapes and no forum. The book was really all I needed. Once I had the principles and called Jean a few times the first year, I would never have gone back to diets.
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